[00:00:02] Hey everyone, welcome back to The Outcomes Rocket, Founder Stories. So excited that you joined us again. Listen, today I have the privilege of having Mike Koelzer on the podcast with us. He is the host of The Business of Pharmacy Podcast for over five years. He's a prominent voice in the pharmacy business community. He's a seasoned pharmacist and owner of an independent pharmacy in Grand Rapids, Michigan. And he brings up wealth.

[00:00:32] Of expertise and firsthand experience to his discussions. I'm really excited to have him here on the podcast because we definitely need more high touch that the pharmacy industry does bring us locally. And Mike, I'm excited to have you here on the podcast with us.

[00:00:51] Saul, thanks for having me on.

[00:00:52] Saul, thanks for having me on the podcast.

[00:01:01] I'm a third generation independent pharmacy owner. So it's a family business, but none of my other siblings are in it. My dad used to say this runs on a benevolent dictatorship. So with my grandpa and dad passed on, I'm now the benevolent dictator. And I grew up more probably as a son of a business owner, more so than a son of a pharmacist. So that was kind of in my blood.

[00:01:25] So I think I'm only a pharmacist probably because I saw it as a kid. And if my dad can do it, I can do it kind of thing.

[00:01:33] So that's been my history there. And I've always kind of dreamed I was always kind of a corner independent single pharmacist.

[00:01:41] And I dreamed about doing something bigger. And my brothers and so on went on to big corporations and things like that. And I kind of thought I kind of missed my opportunity. But in fact, it was with podcasting and in media without a middleman. It got me further than I could have imagined by opening my voice up.

[00:02:02] That's awesome. That's awesome. And for those that don't know your podcast, why don't you tell us a little bit about it and the topics you cover and why people should listen?

[00:02:12] So ours is the Business of Pharmacy podcast. And what it is, it's an hour show. It comes out every Monday morning. It's not scripted at all. So we go wherever we want to go. There's no prepared questions.

[00:02:25] And I'm typically talking to people that are influential in the pharmacy space. And that would be anywhere from different PBM owners, you know, different business owners, different CEOs that have done some cool things in the pharmacy space.

[00:02:44] And what I try to do is not have anybody on there that I already know what they're going to say. And so I don't bring anybody on that is typically a pharmacy owner and is doing the same stuff I'm doing.

[00:02:58] And, you know, like we're giving a gift to the listeners on how to do this. It's more like what interests me? Who are the people that I like to talk to that I never could without a podcast?

[00:03:09] You know, I just can't call up some CEO and say, hey, sit down with this old guy and talk to me for an hour.

[00:03:15] So it's always things that I'm interested in, things I don't know, conversations I've never had before.

[00:03:21] And so it's an interesting growth for me rather than for the listeners. But I think that shines forth.

[00:03:27] If I'm bringing something interesting to me, the listeners kind of come along, too.

[00:03:31] Yeah, no, I love that. I love your perspective on how to approach the conversations, Mike.

[00:03:37] As you sort of have been chatting with a lot of these these leaders in the pharmacy space, not necessarily pharmacists.

[00:03:45] How would you say the show is different than what's out there?

[00:03:49] How are you guys adding value to the to the ecosystem?

[00:03:52] Yeah, I think the difference is I bring my 45 years of both experience in the pharmacy, starting when I was 13.

[00:03:59] That's way too long. But I bring my experiences, some of my joys, some of my hatred of things in the business.

[00:04:08] And I think the conversation I bring is just an honest conversation.

[00:04:13] We don't really have any directions on where we want to go in the show, just except to keep it interesting.

[00:04:20] I record probably an hour and 20 minutes of the show.

[00:04:24] I have to pare down about 20, 25 minutes of that to pull out some of my baloney or some of the conversations that didn't seem to go anywhere.

[00:04:32] And I think what I offer, I'm always trying to decide this all.

[00:04:35] I'm always saying, what do I offer to people?

[00:04:38] And I think it's and I know you do it.

[00:04:41] You probably spend more time on YouTube with things that you know than with things that you don't know.

[00:04:47] So whatever your hobby is, whatever your, you know, different things you like watching, you don't say, I'm not going to watch it anymore.

[00:04:54] I'm going to watch something new that I don't that I don't know about.

[00:04:57] It's like, no, you go back to the stuff you do.

[00:05:00] And why is that?

[00:05:01] It's maybe to feel like you're on target with the rest of the people in your group.

[00:05:06] Feel like there's a sense of belonging, you know, some camaraderie ship.

[00:05:11] You know, sometimes it can get lonely in a business.

[00:05:13] I know in our pharmacy it's lonely because there's nobody at my level of things I have to do in the business and so on.

[00:05:20] So I think that's what it offers the listener.

[00:05:22] I think it offers a sense of camaraderie ship, I guess, to their day.

[00:05:26] I like that.

[00:05:27] Now, that's great.

[00:05:28] That's really good stuff.

[00:05:29] So how many shows have you done?

[00:05:31] Like how far along are you?

[00:05:32] So I come out every Monday and I've done that on purpose because I once heard that someone said,

[00:05:38] if you want to make a mark in this world, you have to do something so that when you're not there, you're going to be missed.

[00:05:45] And so I've always done things that way where I suppose at the pharmacy, you know, if our building's not there, we're going to be missed.

[00:05:52] But also with the podcast, that's why I've come out the same time once a week.

[00:05:57] Kind of get people looking forward to it and you're going to be missed if you don't have it.

[00:06:01] So I've done that since 2019.

[00:06:04] So, you know, five times 50 some from about 270 shows in.

[00:06:09] And I had some repeat guests, but all in all, I probably had 250, 60 different people on the show.

[00:06:16] That's awesome.

[00:06:16] Congratulations.

[00:06:17] I think the stats are most podcasts stop after seven.

[00:06:22] And then if you make it beyond 50, you're like single digits percent.

[00:06:28] Is that right?

[00:06:29] Yeah. So you're certainly you've done it, Mike.

[00:06:32] What's been the single best thing you've gotten out of recording the podcast?

[00:06:38] Hmm.

[00:06:39] Well, I'm selfish.

[00:06:40] I have to go back to what I like about it.

[00:06:42] What I think I like is one time when I was younger in my basement, I redid my basement.

[00:06:48] And just like I think a lot of guys do, I just sat down there as it was getting done and just stared at it, you know, and my wife's like, what are you doing?

[00:06:54] It's like, I go look at what I did.

[00:06:55] And I asked my friend about that, who was in a similar state of life with me.

[00:07:00] And I said, why do we do that?

[00:07:02] And he said, well, Mike, in the pharmacy, you go in in the morning and you leave in the evening and everything looks the same.

[00:07:08] Yeah.

[00:07:08] You know, you've helped people in that, but everything looks exactly the same.

[00:07:12] And so I think either realistically or at least figuratively, the podcast is a way for me to march forward in life.

[00:07:22] It's to look at my look at what I'm doing.

[00:07:24] Look back at the shows.

[00:07:26] Can't believe that I put out 250 of them.

[00:07:29] But it's just a chugging through the task list every day with the shows and doing that.

[00:07:34] So I think the biggest thing I've got from it is maybe it's delivering.

[00:07:39] You know, a lot of people have ideas and a lot of people have excuses, but it's been cool just to see that I could do it and just deliver on it.

[00:07:47] And I think that's maybe a big rewarding part of it for me.

[00:07:51] I love it, Mike.

[00:07:52] Yeah, it's a sense of contribution.

[00:07:54] That's right.

[00:07:55] You keep showing up to the game.

[00:07:56] Showing up.

[00:07:57] That's right.

[00:07:57] It allows you to connect with leaders that are at your level or above to kind of get that inspiration because it's hard, right?

[00:08:05] It's lonely when you're running a business.

[00:08:07] That's right.

[00:08:07] Yeah, it's lonely.

[00:08:09] And I've always said it gets lonelier when sometimes things in the business get tighter because you can cover up a lot of stuff with $100 bills for people.

[00:08:16] But when you go through some tricky times in the business, it can get lonely in the position.

[00:08:21] Yeah, I love that.

[00:08:22] No, thanks for sharing.

[00:08:23] And look, tricky times happen in business.

[00:08:26] Talk to us about a challenge that you've had and kind of building the audience, building the podcast.

[00:08:32] And what's a key thing that rises to the top as one of the biggest challenges you've had?

[00:08:37] And how has it made you better?

[00:08:39] I would think probably the biggest challenge, and I alluded to it earlier, the biggest challenge was the biggest thrill and the biggest challenge was breaking away from realizing that you are just.

[00:08:52] And there's a lot of pride in that, but being an independent pharmacy owner.

[00:08:55] But it's kind of the, you know, it's a wonderful life with the main character who wanted to go across the world and do things.

[00:09:03] And he kind of got roped into his family business.

[00:09:06] And at the end, it was a wonderful life.

[00:09:08] But I'm doing that yet.

[00:09:10] I also had the chance to, with the beauty of media and not having a middleman, not having somebody that you need permission from to do this kind of stuff.

[00:09:20] I think that would have been the biggest challenge of having to, you know, schmooze all the, which I did when I was younger, schmooze before the internet.

[00:09:28] Believe it or not, Saul, there was a time before the internet.

[00:09:31] But just schmoozing with the reporters and with the, you know, newscasters and all that.

[00:09:39] And then going from that and then saying there's no middleman anymore.

[00:09:43] And it's just, so the challenge, I think, is just getting over that hump of saying there's no middleman and let's go.

[00:09:49] There's no end to it.

[00:09:50] That's fantastic.

[00:09:51] Yeah, it's a big opportunity in connecting with people and growing your business and opening up doors and raising your IQ, your, just the connections.

[00:10:02] It's an incredible opportunity.

[00:10:04] For sure.

[00:10:04] Mike, you're an example in sort of the podcasting field.

[00:10:08] What call to action would you leave to folks listening today around podcasting, around pharmacy and things that they should be considering?

[00:10:17] I think with anything in life, especially with media, and I've kind of spoken to it, there's never been a time like now where you cannot move forward if you want to.

[00:10:30] And I kind of consider it like, I kind of go to sports.

[00:10:33] There's some sports that people can't do.

[00:10:35] It's like, I'd like to be a race car driver.

[00:10:37] Well, what chance am I going to have of doing that?

[00:10:39] You know, and then you see the people that are good at race car driving.

[00:10:42] You're like, well, how good are they?

[00:10:44] They maybe had some chances and things like that.

[00:10:47] This is an example.

[00:10:48] I have no, I'm not a race car driver, never want to be.

[00:10:51] And then you look at something like soccer.

[00:10:53] You know, it's like anybody can do soccer as long as they have a ball.

[00:10:57] And so anybody can do it.

[00:10:59] But now it's harder to rise to the top because there's nobody in your way.

[00:11:03] And so it's all up to you.

[00:11:05] So again, this is the first time in history.

[00:11:07] I've told my kids, it's like years ago, if you heard somebody back when I was going to

[00:11:12] high school, Saul, if you heard somebody was not going to go to college and was going to

[00:11:15] be a barber or a, you know, car mechanic or something like that, you'd say, yeah, you

[00:11:20] know, you didn't quite make it in life.

[00:11:23] Now, if my kids came to me and said, I'm going to be an auto mechanic and I'm going to do it

[00:11:28] with this social media, I'm going to rise to the top with this and have whatever the podcast

[00:11:33] or this or that, you know, it's like, whoa, and you're just going to go to college, you

[00:11:37] know, to the other one.

[00:11:38] So it's like you can have these cool dreams and nobody can stop you and no one's in your

[00:11:42] way.

[00:11:43] So I tell the kids, it's like, I've lived it where you have that middleman that's just

[00:11:46] not there anymore.

[00:11:47] So roll with it, do everything you can with it.

[00:11:50] And there's no excuses.

[00:11:52] That's awesome, Mike.

[00:11:53] I love that perspective a lot.

[00:11:55] And sky is the limit.

[00:11:57] Social media has given us a lot of capabilities, a democratization of radio, which is

[00:12:03] podcast now has opened up a lot of voices.

[00:12:06] So I love that closing note that you've left us with.

[00:12:09] If you guys think that it's not possible, just open up your mind and let's listen to

[00:12:16] Mike on really the possibility.

[00:12:17] It's that belief that you could get out there and make a difference.

[00:12:20] That's going to make it.

[00:12:22] Mike, if people want to tune into your podcast and connect with you, what's the best way and

[00:12:26] best place that they could do it?

[00:12:28] Probably the easiest, Saul, is just to think of what it is.

[00:12:31] It's the Business of Pharmacy podcast.

[00:12:33] And if they look that up, that'll take them to where they need to go.

[00:12:36] Well, that is easy peasy.

[00:12:39] So folks, take advantage of that.

[00:12:41] Tune into Mike's show.

[00:12:43] It's linked up in the show notes.

[00:12:44] If you want to click on that, go listen to a couple episodes.

[00:12:48] I think you'll enjoy them.

[00:12:49] And really just want to thank you, Mike, for joining us.

[00:12:52] This has been a lot of fun.

[00:12:53] Thank you, Saul.

[00:12:54] And you're coming on my show in another month or so.

[00:12:56] So I want to plug that for you too in advance.

[00:12:58] Yes.

[00:12:59] Looking forward to it, Mike.

[00:13:01] Thanks for having me on yours as well.

[00:13:02] And thank you for being with us.

[00:13:04] Thanks, Saul.

[00:13:05] Bye.